Everton v Villa

Armchair wrote:Positives from today: Southampton lost (shame it was to Leeds), Bournemouth having their goal difference further screwed by City, Nottingham Forest lose so they are back in the mix (also with an awful GD). Leicester lost as well although I think they'll pull clear. Draw for Wolves yesterday.

So the other games generally went in our favour, just a shame we couldn't get at a point. Villa are much improved under Emery though, so not a surprising result.

I thought Villa gave us fewer problems than I thought they would.
They started off OK but I can't say I was terrified until Gana Gueye did his thing
Give us a number 9, we would be talking differently.

Terrible day today, but not terminal.

I'm no longer allowing myself to get too positive after a win, nor too down after a defat. It's going down to the wire.

It's still any three from nine. We remain the favourites to go along with Bournemouth and Southampton, IMO. But there is a long way to go and nothing is cast in stone yet.

The most significant result of the day for us, apart from our own defeat, might be Forest getting hammered.

Goodison_Gringo wrote:Lack of a striker, pure and simple. Can only really blame the board for this.

The fans' toxicity was the burner.
Man Unt wouldn't loan us one of their players because of the toxic nature of the crowd, and his development would be hindered.
How many others thought - feck this for a game of marbles. I don't need to get murdered by Bullens Road.
We're in dudu unless we get DCL back, and quick.

I was both encouraged and discouraged by the performance.

I felt the players had a good urgency about the game, generally pretty quick passing with a good tempo. Unfortunately, not having a recognized striker on the pitch that can not only finish but also hold up play was clearly a massive issue. Maupay works hard and runs around trying to chase down defenders, but that's about it. No end product, no holding up the ball.

Villa, I felt, were rather fortunate to get the penalty. Gana got his toe on the ball and McGinn went down rather easily. Villa were simply more clinical.

I'm trying to stay positive, but it'll come down to the wire again - just hoping we can do it again this season.

Yankthattoffee wrote:

Goodison_Gringo wrote:Lack of a striker, pure and simple. Can only really blame the board for this.

The fans' toxicity was the burner.
Man Unt wouldn't loan us one of their players because of the toxic nature of the crowd, and his development would be hindered.
How many others thought - feck this for a game of marbles. I don't need to get murdered by Bullens Road.
We're in dudu unless we get DCL back, and quick.

I do think you go a bit too easy on the board sometimes yank, I think our current issues are largely of the board's making.

But this is a good point. On the last couple of days before the window closed, even I was thinking to myself "why would anyone sane willingly walk into this shitshow?"

The toxicity of the fans was a symptom though. The board was the cause. To a player or agent weighing up a move to Everton, none of that matters, they don't have to look for root causes, they just need to check the temperature in the room and turn the offer down in favour of somewhere cooler, somewhere less mental.

Rotterdam 1985 wrote:

Yankthattoffee wrote:

Goodison_Gringo wrote:Lack of a striker, pure and simple. Can only really blame the board for this.

The fans' toxicity was the burner.
Man Unt wouldn't loan us one of their players because of the toxic nature of the crowd, and his development would be hindered.
How many others thought - feck this for a game of marbles. I don't need to get murdered by Bullens Road.
We're in dudu unless we get DCL back, and quick.

I do think you go a bit too easy on the board sometimes yank, I think our current issues are largely of the board's making.

But this is a good point. On the last couple of days before the window closed, even I was thinking to myself "why would anyone sane willingly walk into this shitshow?"

The toxicity of the fans was a symptom though. The board was the cause. To a player or agent weighing up a move to Everton, none of that matters, they don't have to look for root causes, they just need to check the temperature in the room and turn the offer down in favour of somewhere cooler, somewhere less mental.

Not defending the board, but plenty of players got unnecessary stick from our fans before Mosh and his money turned up. Barkley springs to mind. No doubt the current situation has made it worse though.

Rotterdam 1985 wrote:

Yankthattoffee wrote:

Goodison_Gringo wrote:Lack of a striker, pure and simple. Can only really blame the board for this.

The fans' toxicity was the burner.
Man Unt wouldn't loan us one of their players because of the toxic nature of the crowd, and his development would be hindered.
How many others thought - feck this for a game of marbles. I don't need to get murdered by Bullens Road.
We're in dudu unless we get DCL back, and quick.

I do think you go a bit too easy on the board sometimes yank, I think our current issues are largely of the board's making.

But this is a good point. On the last couple of days before the window closed, even I was thinking to myself "why would anyone sane willingly walk into this shitshow?"

The toxicity of the fans was a symptom though. The board was the cause. To a player or agent weighing up a move to Everton, none of that matters, they don't have to look for root causes, they just need to check the temperature in the room and turn the offer down in favour of somewhere cooler, somewhere less mental.

The real damage was caused by the board who oversaw the Koeman/Walsh debacle. The Usmanov influence. I was at Villa when everyone sang "We're fecking rich, we're fecking rich!" and that board were just stupid and ill guided. This board has been playing catch up since. Have they done a good job? Clearly not, and communication seems to be the big problem here. Maybe they should take a hint from the Ultras of Napoli and have a supporter's club leader on the baord?

I agree with Yank that Villa gave us less problems than I thought they would.  They were certainly no better than us, but once Villa got that very soft pen, it was unlikely we'd get even a point.

We were no better or worse than we were against Leeds - it's fine margins.  But when we have no striker worthy of the name, we're going to lose a lot of games.

Again, I thought we looked better with Simms on the pitch, but I suppose Dyche is looking at the bigger picture - can we keep a game at nil nil longer with Maupay and Iwobi on the pitch than we can with Simms and Gray?  I kind of wonder if at some point he's going to decide to get a bit more adventurous and change it up, or will he wait for DCL to regain full fitness, by which time we'll probably adrift at the foot of the table.

McNeil must have put in about 20 crosses, some of which were decent, but nobody is getting on the end of them.  I thought Dwight was probably our best player (again).  Onana should put on a short skirt and get some pompoms if all he's going to do is try to be a cheerleader to the crowd.  Once he got that early yellow he was a passenger for much of the game.

Anyway, it's not looking good is it?  To look at it positively, we've won every other game under Dyche and if we carry on like that we'll survive.  On the negative side, it's highly unlikely to carry on like that.  

Doomed.

Rotterdam 1985 wrote:

Yankthattoffee wrote:

Goodison_Gringo wrote:Lack of a striker, pure and simple. Can only really blame the board for this.

The fans' toxicity was the burner.
Man Unt wouldn't loan us one of their players because of the toxic nature of the crowd, and his development would be hindered.
How many others thought - feck this for a game of marbles. I don't need to get murdered by Bullens Road.
We're in dudu unless we get DCL back, and quick.

I do think you go a bit too easy on the board sometimes yank, I think our current issues are largely of the board's making.

But this is a good point. On the last couple of days before the window closed, even I was thinking to myself "why would anyone sane willingly walk into this shitshow?"

The toxicity of the fans was a symptom though. The board was the cause. To a player or agent weighing up a move to Everton, none of that matters, they don't have to look for root causes, they just need to check the temperature in the room and turn the offer down in favour of somewhere cooler, somewhere less mental.

Given the type of assignments I generally now get, I feel qualified enough to say tow things. Amazingly they could almost be diametrically opposed but each, in their own right, are truisms.

Looking at the Board - for what ever reason there has been a failing to develop a strategy and stick with it.

Having a DoF is the CORRECT idea. Walsh was a very short sighted almost knee-jerk reaction to what Leicester had achieved rather than what Everton actually needed ("well we need to grab him because if he did it at Leicester"). Bringing in Marcel Brands was a BRILLIANT decision. Pairing him with Koeman was a good fit. Sacking Koeman after the start we had, when we are asked to face in the first 8 weeks of the season each of the 5/6 clubs who finished above us the season before was equally short-sighted.

Binning Silva in hindsight now looks questionable. Prior boards hung with Kendall and with Moyes. Our change of policy (driven by the fanbase sentiment) has been questionable ever since. Hiring a manager with fixed views of Benitez (running counter to the agreed strategy) was incredibly negligent IMHO.


Looking at the fanbase - we have around 35000 season ticket holders at an average "investment" around (being generous £400 per person per season). So the fans watching the team equates to around £14m per season. For that they want to hold the board accountable. The only people who can hold a board accountable are shareholders. Everyone else is a customer who have a choice to use/consume the brand on offer or not.

To Yank's laudable beef. Unless you can directly impact the result we should recognise the place we have in the Everton firmament and give nothing other than our compete support. Any fan out there who really has a protecting gripe I would say this.

"The people you are moaning about - Mosh primarily - has coughed up so far around £250,000,000 over 7 years or around £35m per annum- which excludes the Stadium build cost. The average salary for fans at the club is likely to be in or around the national salary - allowing for regional variation £30k. So each fan would need to commit ALL his annual income for 1,000 years to meet just one Year's investment from Mosh.

Think on that. That is how much money is needed to be invested. As a club, with the numbers we have and the socio economic climate within which we reside, let's reflect on where we would be without that investment.

Everton fans are not alone in this quandary. Only two clubs realistically are positioned to have the wealth and the resources to provide success (or likelihood of current and future success regardless of fan sentiment) - Manchester City and Newcastle United.


The season 2022-23 will pass as all others have passed - we will record our performances regardless of fan input or Board micro-management. The stark reality is that for the funds available there is no talent available to us to guarantee our future. We had a choice to spend the money in one of two ways. The Ground ad club infrastructure (the stuff that actually is far more connected to the fans than they realise) or to ephemeral journeymen contractors (playing staff) whose affinity can best be described as close to that of a prostitute.

I joke with friends if I ever won the hundreds of millions on the Euro Lottery then a significant proportion would be invested in the Club but only on the proviso we retrenched our player development into a defined geographical context. We may not get the best players - we will develop some stars (Rooney, Owen, McManaman, McMahon, Rush, Hibbert, Barkley, Carragher, etc... - and all of them would have a really close identity to the club, its ideals and objectives. Yes they would actually be more likely to die for the badge (to quote the great Dave Hickson).

I still think we might just escape. I do think we stick with Dyche regardless. I am happy for Moshiri to remain because building the stadium successfully IS THE RIGHT IDEA, later than ideal. IT IS THE RIGHT STRATEGY. Sticking with that and reviewing and overhauling in the light of performance the playing strategy - I am happy with. Not convinced of the current DoF but that is the better structure going forward.

From the Board perspective , Kenwright I am amazed if he is offering anything of value. He should be forced out. Denis Baxendale - ok for her to be senior on the board as long as she has a solid reporting (and assessment ) of the DoF

Rant off!