DAVID MOYES - ex Boss

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Post  BB on Mon 23 Aug 2010, 7:15 pm

Knight of Thorgothshire wrote:
Barry Horne's Equaliser wrote:
Knight of Thorgothshire wrote:
Statman wrote:
Knight of Thorgothshire wrote:The Fellaini, to me at leats, made little sense. He's well off the pace and he's not that creative when it comes down to it. Fellaini is too slow at the moment. Rodwell would have been a much better option since he is more willing to have a go at the defence and will take the occasional shot on goal as well. And Osman is Osman. Great servant to the club, but he's lightweight and that won't change anytime soon. Gueye had a great pre-season and has pace. Why not put him on instead? So, in essence I disagree with both of those subs.

KoT, we need to move on from calling Premiership footballers servants.

Good point, when they make more in a week than I do in a year.


At least you're a great servant to this board. Very Happy
lol! cheers And so are you!


Oh my goodness gracious. Get a frickin room guys. cheers

DAVID MOYES - ex Boss - Page 7 Pray+your+gay+away

lol!
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Post  Knight of Thorgothshire on Mon 23 Aug 2010, 7:24 pm

BB wrote:
Knight of Thorgothshire wrote:
Barry Horne's Equaliser wrote:
Knight of Thorgothshire wrote:
Statman wrote:
Knight of Thorgothshire wrote:The Fellaini, to me at leats, made little sense. He's well off the pace and he's not that creative when it comes down to it. Fellaini is too slow at the moment. Rodwell would have been a much better option since he is more willing to have a go at the defence and will take the occasional shot on goal as well. And Osman is Osman. Great servant to the club, but he's lightweight and that won't change anytime soon. Gueye had a great pre-season and has pace. Why not put him on instead? So, in essence I disagree with both of those subs.

KoT, we need to move on from calling Premiership footballers servants.

Good point, when they make more in a week than I do in a year.


At least you're a great servant to this board. Very Happy
lol! cheers And so are you!


Oh my goodness gracious. Get a frickin room guys. cheers

DAVID MOYES - ex Boss - Page 7 Pray+your+gay+away

lol!
You are just upset because you didn't get the invite. Wink I love you
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Post  callmebubbles on Mon 23 Aug 2010, 8:49 pm

Mr_Ben wrote:
SEFTON wrote:david moyes selection against wolves?

1) distin instead of heitinga?

2) hibbert instead of coleman?

3) pienaar on the right?

4) heitinga defensive midfield instead of rodders?

5) substittions?

6) meyguye not used ?



1. Looks like he wanted to be defensive, also he must have thought that partnership is best. Maybe he thinks JH is CDM and not a CB

2. Coleman is not proven Hibbo is.

3. Osman was shit v Blackburn and I can see why he brought in Bily, albeit he was also shit, and put Pienaar on the RW. Also Vic is injured and it shows how week we are at RW

4. See 1. also JH has more experience there.

5. Agree they were shit, replacing shit with shit

6. We used all 3 subs, Don't know why he didn't go 442 or 433.


Hibbo is proven shite!!

Surely Coleman must be worth a shot?
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Post  tadpole3 on Mon 23 Aug 2010, 8:52 pm

I too was disappointed that Coleman didn't start, but in my view Hibbert played very well and justified Moyes's selection.

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Post  hairy cataract on Mon 23 Aug 2010, 8:55 pm

History tells us that Moyes is very slow at introducing new players unless injuries force his hand. Rooney is an example, as is Rodwell. After he signed Baines, he wouldn't play him for ages. Coleman won't get a game unless Hibbo and Pip are both injured. Rodwell won't get a regular start until there is no alternative.

On the one hand, it's great that we have no long-term injuries. On the other hand it means that we can expect to see plenty of first-team action for Hibbert, Neville, Saha, and Osman,
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Post  Knight of Thorgothshire on Mon 23 Aug 2010, 9:05 pm

tadpole3 wrote:I too was disappointed that Coleman didn't start, but in my view Hibbert played very well and justified Moyes's selection.
I mentioned the same in the match thread, Hibbo did well. He can still improve his crosses, but he did well over lapping and defended pretty well as well.
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Post  BB on Mon 23 Aug 2010, 9:21 pm

tadpole3 wrote:I too was disappointed that Coleman didn't start, but in my view Hibbert played very well and justified Moyes's selection.

I think Hibbert has been performing well for a long time now. He had a bit of a blip in the final, but can't really complain at his performances since. I hope he scores then we can move on without remorse when the time comes.
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Post  Cahill the Great on Mon 23 Aug 2010, 9:34 pm

BB wrote:
tadpole3 wrote:I too was disappointed that Coleman didn't start, but in my view Hibbert played very well and justified Moyes's selection.

I think Hibbert has been performing well for a long time now. He had a bit of a blip in the final, but can't really complain at his performances since. I hope he scores then we can move on without remorse when the time comes.


Lets be honest we cant really blame Hibbo for what wasnt a bad defensive display. Its going forward where we seem to have problems and Coleman is the better option here. What has happened to Saha? - hasnt looked the same player recently. I agree with the selection mistakes that others have highlighted. Cant understand why Moyes would go defensive against Wolves at home. DAVID MOYES - ex Boss - Page 7 Confused

Its only 2 games but a vey dissapointing start considering the opposition. I dont think any of the players have shone during the 1st 2 games. If Moyes isnt going to play the Yak then he should sell him and put towards another player.

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Post  Knight of Thorgothshire on Mon 23 Aug 2010, 10:55 pm

Cahill the Great wrote:
BB wrote:
tadpole3 wrote:I too was disappointed that Coleman didn't start, but in my view Hibbert played very well and justified Moyes's selection.

I think Hibbert has been performing well for a long time now. He had a bit of a blip in the final, but can't really complain at his performances since. I hope he scores then we can move on without remorse when the time comes.


Lets be honest we cant really blame Hibbo for what wasnt a bad defensive display. Its going forward where we seem to have problems and Coleman is the better option here. What has happened to Saha? - hasnt looked the same player recently. I agree with the selection mistakes that others have highlighted. Cant understand why Moyes would go defensive against Wolves at home. DAVID MOYES - ex Boss - Page 7 Confused

Its only 2 games but a vey dissapointing start considering the opposition. I dont think any of the players have shone during the 1st 2 games. If Moyes isnt going to play the Yak then he should sell him and put towards another player.

Sell the Yak and Bily, and get a winger/striker in.
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Post  Made 4 Gwladys on Mon 23 Aug 2010, 11:48 pm

i know saha has not looked great but he has to be a better start than Beckford..

i thought Beckford looked totally out of his depth... at best he should be on the bench until he gets a few prem runs under his belt & few goals as sub...


the worst twat on the park was Mason... or was it Phil Mitchell on crack
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Post  BB on Tue 24 Aug 2010, 12:18 am

I think you all should be ashamed of yourselves doubting Moyes. lol! DAVID MOYES - ex Boss - Page 7 F_whistl
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Post  Knight of Thorgothshire on Tue 24 Aug 2010, 3:51 am

Made 4 Gwladys wrote:i know saha has not looked great but he has to be a better start than Beckford..

i thought Beckford looked totally out of his depth... at best he should be on the bench until he gets a few prem runs under his belt & few goals as sub...


the worst twat on the park was Mason... or was it Phil Mitchell on crack
I think it shows how thin we are up front though, Saha was not good against Blackburn and Moyes wanted to try something a bitdifferent. Unfortuntalely Beckford was not the answer on the day. I was actually more disappointed by the Osman and Fellaini subs. We needed someone who could get in behind the defence, some one with pace and skills, so why not give Gueye a go? Osman and Fellaini offered neither pace nor the ability to get in behind the defenders. Nor were they capable of proving the passes to make that happen.
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Post  Top Balcony Blue on Tue 24 Aug 2010, 9:19 am

In fairness I had no complaints with the first half performance, apart from the decision-making in the final third. Let's be fair to Moyes, Heitinga may play in defensive roles but he's one of our best passers of the ball and likes to get forward. He complemented Arteta well in the middle. If you like he was our insurance policy, allowing Arteta, Pienaar, Billy, Cahill and the two full backs to push forward. If we decided to shoot at goal more often instead of trying to walk it into the net we'd have been 3-4 up in that first half, and we wouldn't be having this discussion.

The second half for the most part was played in a similar vein and we had opportunities to finish them off but yet again we made poor decisions in the final third (the main one being Beckford not slipping Heitinga through on goal).

Clearly the subs were poor and one in particular (Saha) had a hugely negative impact on us. He does my head in when he trys to get involved in the play. He couldn't trap a bag of cement at the moment and cost us a goal losing the ball and enabling them to counter ruthlessly - somethin g which was lacking in our attacking play. We crumbled after that which is worrying. A lack of belief IMO. We'll be hard-pressed to find a worse side than Wolves come to Goodison this season, yet we made them look world beaters in that last 20 minutes.

Overall, we've got to try and be a bit sensible about the situation. Some of our build up play is superb at times and will get better. We need to be ruthless in the final third, and Moyes needs to use his options better. It's all stuff that can be worked on and ironed out IMO, although the lack of a ruthless goalscorer in the final third (it used to be the Yak) is something which could hamper us.
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Post  Albert on Tue 24 Aug 2010, 9:48 am

some people would have you believe coleman was the next cafu. he can't defend and just gets his head down and runs when he gets the ball. he's not worth a start yet.
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Post  SEFTON on Tue 24 Aug 2010, 9:57 am

Top Balcony Blue wrote:In fairness I had no complaints with the first half performance, apart from the decision-making in the final third. Let's be fair to Moyes, Heitinga may play in defensive roles but he's one of our best passers of the ball and likes to get forward. He complemented Arteta well in the middle. If you like he was our insurance policy, allowing Arteta, Pienaar, Billy, Cahill and the two full backs to push forward. If we decided to shoot at goal more often instead of trying to walk it into the net we'd have been 3-4 up in that first half, and we wouldn't be having this discussion.

The second half for the most part was played in a similar vein and we had opportunities to finish them off but yet again we made poor decisions in the final third (the main one being Beckford not slipping Heitinga through on goal).

Clearly the subs were poor and one in particular (Saha) had a hugely negative impact on us. He does my head in when he trys to get involved in the play. He couldn't trap a bag of cement at the moment and cost us a goal losing the ball and enabling them to counter ruthlessly - somethin g which was lacking in our attacking play. We crumbled after that which is worrying. A lack of belief IMO. We'll be hard-pressed to find a worse side than Wolves come to Goodison this season, yet we made them look world beaters in that last 20 minutes.

Overall, we've got to try and be a bit sensible about the situation. Some of our build up play is superb at times and will get better. We need to be ruthless in the final third, and Moyes needs to use his options better. It's all stuff that can be worked on and ironed out IMO, although the lack of a ruthless goalscorer in the final third (it used to be the Yak) is something which could hamper us.



agree with most of what you said TBB, as you were in a more privalaged position in attending the game,
our strike force seems a bit thin on the ground,beckford settleing in-saha not a leathal preditor as he used to be-the yak no where to be seen ? is he on gardening leave ? anichebie injured and in the midst of signing a new contract,so we are left toothless up-front ,moyes needs to act on recruiting a striker quickly,but not crouch.
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Post  SEFTON on Tue 24 Aug 2010, 10:04 am

BB wrote:I think you all should be ashamed of yourselves doubting Moyes. lol! DAVID MOYES - ex Boss - Page 7 F_whistl


i think nine years in any job should give you an idea about your staff,osman-hibbert-yobo-distin-neville-yak-saha, all not good enough for regular starts in the team,if we are to move on and challenge for champions league football moyes has to replace the above list before there contracts wittle down and we can't get a penny for them.


just my opinion.
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Post  Tonteau on Tue 24 Aug 2010, 10:48 am

treblA wrote:some people would have you believe coleman was the next cafu. he can't defend and just gets his head down and runs when he gets the ball. he's not worth a start yet.

How much of him have you actually seen? Hibbo was bigging up his defending the just other day.
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Post  Super on Tue 24 Aug 2010, 10:51 am

Tonteau wrote:
treblA wrote:some people would have you believe coleman was the next cafu. he can't defend and just gets his head down and runs when he gets the ball. he's not worth a start yet.

How much of him have you actually seen? Hibbo was bigging up his defending the just other day.

Was very impressive with him when I saw him play for Blackpool against Peterborough last season. True he did like to get forward and was not afraid to try and get in the box from the right hand side, but he was also back defending a lot. Not afraid to put in a crunching tackle either.
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Post  Albert on Tue 24 Aug 2010, 11:44 am

Tonteau wrote:
treblA wrote:some people would have you believe coleman was the next cafu. he can't defend and just gets his head down and runs when he gets the ball. he's not worth a start yet.

How much of him have you actually seen? Hibbo was bigging up his defending the just other day.

i've seen him play for the reserves at widnes a few times, on tv and in person for blackpool at bloomfield road, and i watched the everton appearances on tv - benfica away and spurs at home spring to mind.

so, probably more than most people
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Post  Cahill the Great on Tue 24 Aug 2010, 11:55 am

SEFTON wrote:
Top Balcony Blue wrote:In fairness I had no complaints with the first half performance, apart from the decision-making in the final third. Let's be fair to Moyes, Heitinga may play in defensive roles but he's one of our best passers of the ball and likes to get forward. He complemented Arteta well in the middle. If you like he was our insurance policy, allowing Arteta, Pienaar, Billy, Cahill and the two full backs to push forward. If we decided to shoot at goal more often instead of trying to walk it into the net we'd have been 3-4 up in that first half, and we wouldn't be having this discussion.

The second half for the most part was played in a similar vein and we had opportunities to finish them off but yet again we made poor decisions in the final third (the main one being Beckford not slipping Heitinga through on goal).

Clearly the subs were poor and one in particular (Saha) had a hugely negative impact on us. He does my head in when he trys to get involved in the play. He couldn't trap a bag of cement at the moment and cost us a goal losing the ball and enabling them to counter ruthlessly - somethin g which was lacking in our attacking play. We crumbled after that which is worrying. A lack of belief IMO. We'll be hard-pressed to find a worse side than Wolves come to Goodison this season, yet we made them look world beaters in that last 20 minutes.

Overall, we've got to try and be a bit sensible about the situation. Some of our build up play is superb at times and will get better. We need to be ruthless in the final third, and Moyes needs to use his options better. It's all stuff that can be worked on and ironed out IMO, although the lack of a ruthless goalscorer in the final third (it used to be the Yak) is something which could hamper us.



agree with most of what you said TBB, as you were in a more privalaged position in attending the game,
our strike force seems a bit thin on the ground,beckford settleing in-saha not a leathal preditor as he used to be-the yak no where to be seen ? is he on gardening leave ? anichebie injured and in the midst of signing a new contract,so we are left toothless up-front ,moyes needs to act on recruiting a striker quickly,but not crouch.


All our strikers fall into the category of either 'unproven' - Beckford, Gueye and Anichebe or 'past it' - Saha and the Yak.

Moyes top transfer priority should be to find a 20 goal a season striker. Easier said than done I know but he should be able to fund it through the sale of a couple of player from Sefton's list of deadwood above.

I cant believe we didnt take 7m for the Yak. Could have been put towards a decent signing.
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Post  Tonteau on Tue 24 Aug 2010, 12:02 pm

treblA wrote:
Tonteau wrote:
treblA wrote:some people would have you believe coleman was the next cafu. he can't defend and just gets his head down and runs when he gets the ball. he's not worth a start yet.

How much of him have you actually seen? Hibbo was bigging up his defending the just other day.

i've seen him play for the reserves at widnes a few times, on tv and in person for blackpool at bloomfield road, and i watched the everton appearances on tv - benfica away and spurs at home spring to mind.

so, probably more than most people

Fair dos, although I don't think his half-fit debut, out of position in a hugely weakened side away against a very good attacking team is much to judge him on.

His spurs game was great, he flayed Gareth Bale and his defending was fine as well. Needs to play against huddersfield, really.
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Post  Valentino Blue on Tue 24 Aug 2010, 12:54 pm

hairy cataract wrote:History tells us that Moyes is very slow at introducing new players unless injuries force his hand. Rooney is an example, as is Rodwell. After he signed Baines, he wouldn't play him for ages. Coleman won't get a game unless Hibbo and Pip are both injured. Rodwell won't get a regular start until there is no alternative.

On the one hand, it's great that we have no long-term injuries. On the other hand it means that we can expect to see plenty of first-team action for Hibbert, Neville, Saha, and Osman,

I think he likes to bring the new players into a winning team, injuries in the past have forced his hand. Felli and Bily for example would have had a lot more settling in time and been phased into the team if it wasn't for the injury problems we've had over the last couple of seasons rather than being played in a team struggling for confidence. At the moment I think he's looking to put out a solid team of players who have the experience and suuposed ability to get some points on the board and build some momentum. I don't necessarily agree with this method but understand why he's doing it this way having seen the problems we've had rushing players into the first team.

we'd all like to have seen what coleman can do but in fairness Hibbert played reasonably well on saturday especially in the first half and looked to be attempting to link up with Pienaar effectively.

the other changes were pretty much as people expected and wanted after the blackburn game, bily for ossie and becks for saha. personally i'd have prefered bily on the right were i think he's more effective.

Distin has been better than jags so far this season and most of pre season to be fair to him.

rodwell, in my opinion, has been better when played further forward or alongside a DM. I don't think he's got the bite in his game to break up opposition attacks and get stuck in when theres a bit of a battle he certainly doesn't against teams looking to kick our players off the park.

seems to be a lot of blame being deflected from the players at the moment who seem to be under par at the moment. these are largely the same players in the same system who performed so well in the second half of the season, they just seem complacent at the moment.
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Post  BB on Tue 24 Aug 2010, 1:21 pm

SEFTON wrote:
BB wrote:I think you all should be ashamed of yourselves doubting Moyes. lol! DAVID MOYES - ex Boss - Page 7 F_whistl


i think nine years in any job should give you an idea about your staff,osman-hibbert-yobo-distin-neville-yak-saha, all not good enough for regular starts in the team,if we are to move on and challenge for champions league football moyes has to replace the above list before there contracts wittle down and we can't get a penny for them.


just my opinion.

Lol, obviously I was being ironic after starting the 'shape up or ship out' thread myself, but I do agree with what you feel.

He's been here long enough now to know his squad. Does Davey look upon the team as highly as we do though? Where we think we can beat anyone, and only need a few risks being taken, does Davey?

As a defender, Hibbert is actually very good, and I would class him as one of the better defensive right backs over the years in the Prem, but going forward, he has little skill as a footballer, which is hard to fathom as you'd think all pro's could play a bit. Neville is better going forward, but is still as skillful as a donkey with each leg tied to a corner flag as soon as he is approached. For defensive roles, both players can do a job.
The problem is we have no spark in front of them either, so the right side becomes a little lethargic. Who would Everton fans want as a right back if we were to buy one tomorrow?

Ask ourselves this: If we put Aaron Lennon on the right, would he be crossing the ball to an empty box if we attacked on the break, as our other players simply couldn't keep up, as we have no pace in the side?

Enter Jermaine Beckford, who is quick, and fast off the shoulder of the defender. I still think this lad has goals in him, but he needs service, and he needs space to work in. If our team don't move well, then we will never create space, and if we have no width, then we will never create space.

Our movement is poor.
This is why Arteta keeps hold of the ball for so long, and why Pienaar finds himself having to take folks on. Why? Because the lads who are targets for them, in Osman, Bily, Cahill, Yak, Saha are slow and aren't disturbing the formation of the defenders enough. This is why we don't have the final pass on our attack, and it's because we don't have the movement going on.

We have not a single attack minded coach in our whole set up. Everyone is pretty much an ex defender.

Leave Beckford on, and play our fastest other player instead of Cahill, be it Gueye, or even Agard. Just anyone who can take defenders out of position so Arteta and Pienaar can have options. Heck, I'd even see if Vaughan could play as a winger, as he is pretty quick himself.

I talk crap, so ignore me lol. cheers
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Post  BB on Tue 24 Aug 2010, 2:27 pm

http://www.football365.com/story/0,17033,13320_6331966,00.html

Something to read if you're bored I guess.
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Post  Albert on Tue 24 Aug 2010, 3:09 pm

Tonteau wrote:
treblA wrote:
Tonteau wrote:
treblA wrote:some people would have you believe coleman was the next cafu. he can't defend and just gets his head down and runs when he gets the ball. he's not worth a start yet.

How much of him have you actually seen? Hibbo was bigging up his defending the just other day.

i've seen him play for the reserves at widnes a few times, on tv and in person for blackpool at bloomfield road, and i watched the everton appearances on tv - benfica away and spurs at home spring to mind.

so, probably more than most people

Fair dos, although I don't think his half-fit debut, out of position in a hugely weakened side away against a very good attacking team is much to judge him on.

His spurs game was great, he flayed Gareth Bale and his defending was fine as well. Needs to play against huddersfield, really.

yep. ideal game for him.
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